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Hands On With the Nokia Lumia 1020

samzenpus posted about a year ago | from the take-a-look dept.

Handhelds 227

adeelarshad82 writes "Nokia's new phone, Lumia 1020, feels very similar in the hand to Nokia's Lumia 900 and 920, with one exception: it has a camera bump. The 41-megapixel uber-camera projects out very slightly as a black disc on the back. In terms of functionality, though, the camera provides for smooth zooming only a pinch away. However, it takes a noticeable amount of time to lock focus and save images. At one point during hands-on testing, the camera app crashed so hard that it required a phone reboot, which is hopefully just a pre-release firmware issue. The phone itself carries a brightly colored polycarbonate body that rolls around the edges to cradle a 4.5-inch, 1,280-by-768 screen. Lumia 1020 is powered by a dual-core, 1.5-GHz Qualcomm MSM8960 processor which plows through apps well. Speaking of apps, there's a ton of bloatware on here, as you'd expect from any AT&T device. AT&T adds four apps right at the top of the app list. Nokia Lumia is set to hit AT&T shelves on July 26th for $299."

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Why hasn't Nokia crumbled yet? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257205)

People have been telling me that Nokia's poised to collapse by focusing on Windows Mobile instead of Android. And yet they keep making phones, so they must have some money coming in.

Fucking Slashdotters - living in their own bubble.

Re:Why hasn't Nokia crumbled yet? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257411)

people are idiots. They see samsung and google making LOTS of money of android, see android ever where, then conculde to make money you have to make android (it's not going to well for HTC is it, and moto was losing so bad they put a for sale sign on the door).

Re:Why hasn't Nokia crumbled yet? (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257707)

Bubble, my ass.Nokia smartphone unit is loss-making since the declared Symbian phones dead and sales collapsed. Source: Nokia quartely earning reports. Exactly up to this point smartphones sales were increasing and the smart devices unit was profitable. They fired a lot of people (and the smart ones left), sold business units, and even their head quarter to stay a float. Other units like NSN are profitable which a helps. As a smartphone vendor the fall from number 1 to 10. And here a nice picture about the colllapse caused by the switch to Windows Phone: http://www.asymco.com/2013/04/18/lumia-is-the-light-visible/ [asymco.com]

Re:Why hasn't Nokia crumbled yet? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258047)

They have been loosing money for longer than that genius.

Re:Why hasn't Nokia crumbled yet? (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258391)

smart devices contribution margin:
2010 Q2 8,1
2010 Q3 9,3
2010 Q4 11,6
2011 Q1 6,2 (Symbian declared dead)
2011 Q2 -6,2
2011 Q3 -5,9
2011 Q4 -7
2012 Q1 -18,3
2012 Q2 -32,9
2012 Q3 -48,9
2012 Q4 -21,6
2012 Q1 -16,2

Unfortunately... (0)

turrican (55223) | about a year ago | (#44257215)

...it still runs Windows Phone.

Trolling? Not really - I had a 920 but got rid of it because of the OS. Now if they'd just offer a version with Symbian...

Re:Unfortunately... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257317)

What exactly is wrong with Windows Phone?

The UI concept is very elegant and better than anything iOS or Android has to offer. Windows Phone has excellent developer tools, easily the best. I'm not crazy about the system being locked-down, but this is the standard for phones. iOS is considerably worse in this regard and while I will concede that Android is a bit better, it's still quite locked down but not without major security flaws (SD Card permissions for example).

Re:Unfortunately... (1)

turrican (55223) | about a year ago | (#44257495)

Speaking for myself, the OS itself and how it works was fine - and I really did like the hardware (I wanted to take good pictures of my cats, and the phone absolutely delivered in that respect). However, it felt like initial support for software in general - including the OS - was really poor. As for applications, there were a few gems, but most of the stuff I used regularly felt clunky and half-baked, and I definitely had the impression that development resources applied to them was weak (I'm talking about things that should have good resources available to them; facebook, eBay, Amazon, etc).

My phone is my "main PC" currently, because what I do daily doesn't afford much time to use anything other than an easily accessed pocket terminal - and in that regard, the package failed me.

Re:Unfortunately... (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257629)

I got cancer of the penis shortly after I bought a Windows phone. My fiancee later left me and now just had her second baby with a Black man, because what's left of my lil' ol' stump "just ain't gonna cut it with her anymore," she said.

Oh, my poor lil' ol' stump. What a terrible thing to say to a man who lost three-quarters of his dick. I should just buy one 'o' them Asian or Eastern-European brides and syringe my man-gravy up in 'em. Shit. What good is a man with a stump?

Re:Unfortunately... (5, Funny)

turrican (55223) | about a year ago | (#44257661)

"What good is a man with a stump?"

I can tell you're not a typical slashdotter or you'd already know the answer: 3d printing.

Re:Unfortunately... (1)

Barlo_Mung_42 (411228) | about a year ago | (#44258203)

Personally I've been really happy with my 920 but I don't think I could use any phone as my main pc. Which phone did you settle on for that?

Re:Unfortunately... (1)

turrican (55223) | about a year ago | (#44258339)

I went back to an iPhone 4 (a spare we had) for the time being. Prior to that, I was on an iPhone 3GS, and then prior to that, I was strictly a Nokia guy. So, I was really excited by the opportunity to go back to a top-shelf Nokia (I pre-ordered; cyan). I have no special love for iOS, and have very little invested monetarily in that ecosystem, so anything in the way of repurchasing apps is a non-issue. I'm actually pretty hopeful that WP comes around, because I really do like Nokia hardware.

Again, it came down to day to day usability for me. Currently I work in a decidedly un-techy environment, so whatever phone I use essentially serves as my main computing platform. It would have been different were I working I.T. again, where I'd have much more access to everything 'net (and listen to the music that is an IBM Model M).

Heck, I'd probably have posted instead how I was buying one of these outright instead of waiting for the subsidized upgrade!

Re:Unfortunately... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258275)

what the actual fuck!? *this* gets modded down?

standard slashdot anti-ms bullshit, that post actually is the truth (not particularly swaying but the truth nonetheless, along with a subjective view which apparently on this site you're not allowed to have), perhaps the google shill mods just don't like it being said.

yes, trolling (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257329)

I don't get all the hate at windows phone. Symbian?! Please. Our family uses ios, android, and now me with my new 920. My teenage kids love it and want to upgrade. Wp8 has a good selection of apps and the phone just works. The best app of all is the phone app. This wp8 pissing, moaning, and hating is getting old and completely unfounded.

Re:yes, trolling (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257879)

In other words, everyone in the world is like your family and do not have different needs, likes and preferences. personally I could say exactly the same about Symbian in my family back when it was still actively developed. - it seems the guy you replied to (lets just assume that everything on the internet is true) gave it a try but still found it to be lacking. there was no hate in his post, infact i read it more like he was sad it didnt work as well as he hoped.

Re:yes, trolling (1)

turrican (55223) | about a year ago | (#44258393)

"infact i read it more like he was sad it didnt work as well as he hoped."

This.

Re:yes, trolling (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258405)

frankly slashdot has gotten so pathetic that even the mere suggestion that you use or like a microsoft product gets downmodded. but google, oh no they say they do no evil so despite all the privacy violations and the fact that they sell the profile they build of you to advertisers they remain the darling of slashdot at the behest of ignorant fuckwits. don't get me wrong, microsoft are a bunch of cunts for all the shit theyve done but open your fucking eyes and realize that google are no different nor are apple for that matter, these corporations *DO NOT* have your best interests at heart, they will *ALL* sell you out.

so how about a bit of rational thinking and unbiased discussion instead of google shilling and downmodding *EVERYTHING* that isnt lockstep with slashdot groupthink.

Re:Unfortunately... (1)

gmuslera (3436) | about a year ago | (#44257935)

Or provide open drivers (and the photo app) so could be ported to be installed there Android, Tizen, Ubuntu Touch, Sailfish or whatever OS the end buyer prefer. Is pretty bad how localizable i am carrying a cellphone, but giving away all my data makes it some orders worse.

Re:Unfortunately... (4, Informative)

Stormwatch (703920) | about a year ago | (#44258125)

Sounds like you want a modern Nokia... but the TRUE Nokia, how it would be now if the Microsoft plant hadn't destroyed the company. So, you want a Jolla. [theverge.com]

Freekin Awesome. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257219)

Wow.

bloatware (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257251)

The nice thing about "bloatware" on Windows Phone is that it can be uninstalled completely, cleanly and very easily.

Re:bloatware (1)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year ago | (#44257693)

...and then install Android?

Re:bloatware (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257883)

Most Windows Phones are foolproof. You can't install spyware like that easily.

Re:bloatware (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257923)

So only fools need WP*?

That matches my observations here and elswhere. Agreed.

Re:bloatware (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258153)

Something being foolproof doesn't mean only fools use it. I don't follow you here.
But let it not get in the way of your WP bashing.

Meh (4, Insightful)

tmark (230091) | about a year ago | (#44257291)

With a camera phone, I'd say that the time it takes "to lock focus and save images" is arguably far more important than the number of megapixels.

Even with DSLRS, we've long ago reached the point where the average person needs more MP than are available, and none of *them* are at the 41 MP count. They also have far better optics than what is almost certainly in this (Zeiss nametag or not), and it is well understood in that domain that the importance of glass far outweighs the importance of whatever body you happen to be using.

If the point was just to get better low-light performance by packing on more pixels and then binning them, I wonder why they didn't just design sensors with bigger photosites - at least then, reasonable save times and storage consumption would be a possibility. I know that camera novices get sucked into the MP marketing hype, but does anyone buy a phone for the MP in the camera ?

Re:Meh (3, Interesting)

Dr Max (1696200) | about a year ago | (#44257397)

More megapixels means you can take the picture now and zoom in latter, it also allows for much better touching up because you can access pixels that just aren’t there in other phones, as well as good low light performance like you mentioned. Due to the optical image stabilization, time to lock and focus is not as much of a deal breaker because it takes out all the little movements that happen in that time. Images will look noticeably better with this camera, and 6 times optical zoom means you can make photos look even better (for a face you want to stand back and use all your zoom because it minimizes feature, for a car or something you want to get nice a close shot with no zoom, because it accentuates the features) and all kind of manual options for cool exposer shots and what not. If your not in to photography and just want to take self shots of your self with beer in your hand you probably wont care, but if you like your dslr but hate dragging it around this will make a very nice fit.

Re:Meh (4, Informative)

Rockoon (1252108) | about a year ago | (#44257435)

Megapixels aren't as important as the optics.. aka lenses..

I've seen some of the raw pictures that these high mega-pixel cameraphones take.. blurry shit at the pixel level, making them no better than a much lower resolution camera with better glass.

Re:Meh (0)

recoiledsnake (879048) | about a year ago | (#44257643)

What makes you think the lenses are not good?

Its not enough to just include a high
megapixel sensor – the lenses conveying the image to
the sensor have to be of equally high quality.
Together with our partner Carl Zeiss, we yet again
pushed the limits of optical design to match the resolution
of the 41 megapixel camera sensor. To provide
the best optical resolution we increased the number of
lenses used from the five in the award-winning Nokia
808 PureView, to six. The first lens element is made of
high precision glass, and five of the lenses are moulded
high-performance plastic, taking lens manufacturing
precision to the next level.
The lenses are physically very big for a smartphone, and
the optical assembly alone is unique. But that is not all.
We put the whole system inside a completely new kind
of optical image stabilisation system, which uses an
extremely high accuracy sensing system linked to very
small motors which actively move the lens.
The extremely sharp image projected by the six-element
lens system is recorded by the second generation 41MP
BSI sensor, capturing even the smallest of details in the
scene, including detail not visible to the naked eye.

Whitepaper from Nokia on the tech http://i.nokia.com/blob/view/-/2723846/data/1/-/Lumia1020-whitepaper.pdf [nokia.com]

http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3964341&cid=44257603 [slashdot.org]

Re:Meh (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257953)

An experienced and frequent MS shill copy/pasting Nokia marketing bumf without even reformatting for readability?

You guys are getting lazy.

Then again, I guess it must be really disheartening peddling inferior crap for a living. You have my sympathy.

Re:Meh (1)

Dr Max (1696200) | about a year ago | (#44257805)

it's got pretty damn good optics from ziess as well it's not optical zoom but it's damn good glass. I've seen plenty of images from the 808 pure view and they kick serious ass (show me a better smartphone cammera if you disagree).

Re:Meh (2)

cheater512 (783349) | about a year ago | (#44257449)

Yes but the optics point is still critical.
What is the point of being able to zoom in to 41MP when the optics fall over and blur all the pixels to the same value anyway?

And no it has zero optical zoom. It has digital cropping zoom rather than digital scaling zoom.
Flawless zoom quality yes (with MP loss) but no optical elements move. The same picture is seen by the sensor so the zooming is not performed by the optics.

Re:Meh (-1, Troll)

recoiledsnake (879048) | about a year ago | (#44257655)

The optics don't fall over. They're very good.

Its not enough to just include a high
megapixel sensor – the lenses conveying the image to
the sensor have to be of equally high quality.
Together with our partner Carl Zeiss, we yet again
pushed the limits of optical design to match the resolution
of the 41 megapixel camera sensor. To provide
the best optical resolution we increased the number of
lenses used from the five in the award-winning Nokia
808 PureView, to six. The first lens element is made of
high precision glass, and five of the lenses are moulded
high-performance plastic, taking lens manufacturing
precision to the next level.
The lenses are physically very big for a smartphone, and
the optical assembly alone is unique. But that is not all.
We put the whole system inside a completely new kind
of optical image stabilisation system, which uses an
extremely high accuracy sensing system linked to very
small motors which actively move the lens.
The extremely sharp image projected by the six-element
lens system is recorded by the second generation 41MP
BSI sensor, capturing even the smallest of details in the
scene, including detail not visible to the naked eye.

Re:Meh (1)

dfghjk (711126) | about a year ago | (#44257535)

Spoken like someone who doesn't know what he's talking about. I wonder if you've ever uses a camera not built into a phone in your life.

Re:Meh (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257925)

Why? do you have any examples? are you scared you will be shown to not know what you are talking about?

Technical details and sample pictures (2, Insightful)

recoiledsnake (879048) | about a year ago | (#44257603)

If you're comparing a phone camera with a DSLR then it means it has already won. Anyway, here's more technical details.

Sample photos from the phone http://www.flickr.com/photos/87544844%40N00/sets/72157634597356196/ [flickr.com]
Review of the photo tech http://pureviewclub.com/2013/15270 [pureviewclub.com]
Whitepaper from Nokia on the tech http://i.nokia.com/blob/view/-/2723846/data/1/-/Lumia1020-whitepaper.pdf [nokia.com]
Sample photos from the predecessor http://www.flickr.com/groups/nokia808/ [flickr.com]
Nokia presentation showcasing the phone http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_Q3bxo7vJI&hd=1 [youtube.com]

Re:Meh (1)

PhrostyMcByte (589271) | about a year ago | (#44257645)

There's that saying that the best camera is the one you've got on you when the moment happens. This is clearly targeting photographers who can't carry a DSLR with them all the time, or people interested in photography but not willing to commit to an expensive camera.

The 41MP isn't just so you can take gargantuan pictures -- it is intended to replace a zoom lens. The example photos I've seen look comparable to the best point-and-shoots I've seen, and it has exceptional OIS and low-light performance. If they work out the kinks it'll replace a point-and-shoot quite well.

A small target market is made even smaller due to lack of interest in Windows Phone. I can't help wonder how many of these they're expecting to sell.

Re:Meh (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257825)

I agree. 41MP ought to be enough for everybody

Re:Meh (2)

jrumney (197329) | about a year ago | (#44257941)

Megapixels are more important for a phone camera than a DSLR, because on the phone, you don't have optical zoom, so you want the spare pixels to work with for digital zoom.

Re:Meh (2)

Barlo_Mung_42 (411228) | about a year ago | (#44258225)

Not for me. My last phone would take crappy pictures quickly but especially in low light I'd have to fiddle with it and take several to get one that was good enough. My 920 is slower but I spend less time deleting failed attempts. Plus, I'm sure they'll get the speed up a bit by the time it ships.

No one will buy it because of the OS. (-1, Redundant)

LikwidCirkel (1542097) | about a year ago | (#44257293)

It runs Windows. No one will buy it, and those who do will soon regret it.

Enough with the pretending Windows phones are actually good for something.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about a year ago | (#44257359)

It runs Windows. No one will buy it, and those who do will soon regret it.

Enough with the pretending Windows phones are actually good for something.

I disagree. They will make excellent hand warmers

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1)

cheater512 (783349) | about a year ago | (#44257459)

I still prefer my hand warmers to run Linux as it increases the 'warm and fuzzy' effect of the warmer.
My preferred hand warmer configuration is a Galaxy S3 with a full battery and Google Earth spinning around some 3d buildings.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257591)

i read that as excellent hammers for some reason, and that is damn true i saw a car drive over a 920 and there was barely a scratch on it afterwards.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about a year ago | (#44257633)

I was thinking excellent nails then would be more of a point than a hammer

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258389)

very true, that said i've seen it used as a hammer aswell.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257375)

Try actually using one before spewing crap.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (2)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year ago | (#44257447)

I have. He's right.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

recoiledsnake (879048) | about a year ago | (#44257523)

I too have. He's wrong.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year ago | (#44257617)

Well, "no one will buy it" may be mild hyperbole, but ... what was Windows Phone's market share again? Feel free to include 7 and 8.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1)

mystikkman (1487801) | about a year ago | (#44257803)

Since when is popularity the metric of good quality? By that metric OS X and Linux are very bad OSes.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257957)

I'm pretty much surprised I don't see a comment below this mentioning that Android is Linux.
Or do Google drone nowdays at last know that Android just uses linux kernel and when we speak of Linux as an OS we really mean GNU/Linux which their precious Google spyware has nothing to do with? Can't believe this!

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1)

slack_justyb (862874) | about a year ago | (#44257715)

I second this motion. He's right.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1)

richlv (778496) | about a year ago | (#44258023)

maybe the ac you replied to is elop :)

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257453)

but informed comments are so much more work then writting drivel.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257587)

That's funny, I have a Windows Phone, and I don't regret it at all. Perhaps you need to develop a fucking clue? And maybe some taste along with it?

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (1, Troll)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year ago | (#44257689)

Does anyone else get the feeling that all of these retorts are being done by the same person?

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257981)

Most fandroids do.

Re:No one will buy it because of the OS. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257995)

So Windows Phone makes you into a narrowminded insulting raging lunatic who thinks everyone else should use what you do because it works for you?

Is it just me... (2, Insightful)

MalachiK (1944624) | about a year ago | (#44257345)

or has smartphone technology reached something of a plateau? I mean, I had a iPhone 3GS for years and I held off from upgrading until the 5 was released, thinking that there'd be a step change or paradigm shift of some sort. When the time came I left Apple because looking around it seemed that all of the top of the line handsets are basically the same. I don't exactly push the envelope with my phone useage, and despite what people say I don't know many that do. In terms of the core functionality and interface experience, I couldn't find much to choose between Apple, HTC, Nokia or Samsung.

The iPhone was fantastic back in the day. The touchscreen and build quality were a real step forward and set a new standard. But these day smartphones are just another part of the scenery. Any it's not as if they're really moving forwards. The handsets have gotten as small as they can practically be, and then bigger again. Most handsets use the same style screens. Sure, we get more processing power and what not, but seriously how many cores do you need to check e-mail and post to facebook?

I'm using a Lumia 900 right now. And I'n going to stick with it until the next device comes along that changes the game on the same scale as the iPhone 3G did.

Re:Is it just me... (3)

Billly Gates (198444) | about a year ago | (#44257393)

or has smartphone technology reached something of a plateau? I mean, I had a iPhone 3GS for years and I held off from upgrading until the 5 was released, thinking that there'd be a step change or paradigm shift of some sort. When the time came I left Apple because looking around it seemed that all of the top of the line handsets are basically the same. I don't exactly push the envelope with my phone useage, and despite what people say I don't know many that do. In terms of the core functionality and interface experience, I couldn't find much to choose between Apple, HTC, Nokia or Samsung.

The iPhone was fantastic back in the day. The touchscreen and build quality were a real step forward and set a new standard. But these day smartphones are just another part of the scenery. Any it's not as if they're really moving forwards. The handsets have gotten as small as they can practically be, and then bigger again. Most handsets use the same style screens. Sure, we get more processing power and what not, but seriously how many cores do you need to check e-mail and post to facebook?

I'm using a Lumia 900 right now. And I'n going to stick with it until the next device comes along that changes the game on the same scale as the iPhone 3G did.

I thought so too until recently.

  I had ... actually still do have a Samsung Galaxy S1 captivate circa 2010. It is very slow and the browser crashes at least once a day. I bought a galaxy 4S and couldn't believe the difference! It was freaking fast. It had light sensors in both cameras so the screen could auto adjust brightness. It has motion sensors so the pages go up and down based on your retina scanning. It has voice activation commands. If you click 2 of them together it can double as one screen. They could turn into 4g hubs in case someone in the car has an ipad with just wifi they can have maps and internet access. Warn you if you get near your datacap. Many UI improvements etc.

That is just within 2.5 to 3 years time. I never would have imagined these things and wonder what they will be doing in another 2.5 to 3 years time? They are moving forward fast

Re:Is it just me... (0)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year ago | (#44257501)

So looking at your response, and the previous poster's, it's an interesting contrast. Previous poster is seemingly bored with smartphones, and has decided to stick with his Windows phone. You started from basically the same position (bored with smart phones; they've all become commodity devices) and then exhibited excitement with the feature set and degree of integration presented by the Galaxy.

I'm tempted to say, this recalls the old saying, you use Windows because you have to. You use (any other platform) because you want to.

My daughter has a Galaxy Note, and what has attracted me to it is the included variable pressure stylus. In honesty, I'm a Palm Pilot/Treo guy from way way back, and found myself somewhat excited to see a stylus again, but it's not just that. It's a more advanced stylus than you'd expect on a phone, and is integrated well. (Not perfectly, but you could see where they were going.) I have been holding off on a tablet, but want to try out the Note 10.1. But I'm certainly willing to admit my needs are specialized -- content creation -- which isn't the usual usage model for a tablet.

Re:Is it just me... (1)

dfghjk (711126) | about a year ago | (#44257613)

"I'm tempted to say, this recalls the old saying, you use Windows because you have to. You use (any other platform) because you want to."

Only stupid people make emotional decisions regarding tools, there are far better reasons than "because you want to". If you choose a platform based solely on "want" then you playing with it, not using it. Very different things.

Regarding the topic, what distinguishes a smartphone is its ability to be extended with apps. These days, if it's not Android or iOS, it's at a severe disadvantage. I am not personally a big user of apps yet I gave up my recent switch to Android because the apps sucked so hard...and Android's a dream compared to the 3rd world of smartphones.

Re:Is it just me... (1)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year ago | (#44257669)

I didn't say anything about it being an emotional decision. I'm mildly excited about the Samsung Note series, but because of what it does and how it may fit into my workflow. (Besides the variable pressure stylus, the ability to be a USB master is a selling point.) I currently use Windows because an app I need for content creation currently only runs there (plus certain hardware support). C'est ce que c'est.

Re:Is it just me... (3)

Ambassador Kosh (18352) | about a year ago | (#44257677)

I have been using linux for over 10 years for my servers and desktops. I have also use windows since before 3.x. However I recently got a lumia 521 windows 8 phone. In the price range I was looking at none of the android phones ran the current version of android. The lumia 521 was $130 total to buy. It also has wifi calling. In the labs on campus the cell signal is basically non-existant. I needed a phone so I could continue to deal with customers to pay for my going back to school and doing lab work over the summer. With the wifi calling I can send and receive calls, texts etc all transparently anywhere in any of our buildings since they all have wifi.

This phone has worked very well for me and enabled me to spend a lot more time on campus instead of at home or somewhere where I could use a different phone. Sure windows may not often be a good choice but at least some people choose it because it is the right choice given the available options.

Re:Is it just me... (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about a year ago | (#44258215)

Nothing to do with having to use a tool vs wanting it?

The grandposter said there is no reason to upgrade as a phone is a phone and innovation is slowing. I countered I find the opposite true after what I saw what was out there and how crappy and outdated my Galaxy S1 was.

Things are moving better besides just more ram and a faster processor. Your note is a classic example of innovation. These are coming with more and more sensors and uses. If you just run apps on an old S3 you would not even know what other phones have today. Siri is one example for IPhone users but bluetooth is another too assuming the S3 has that or not (I do not own an IPhone).

Re:Is it just me... (1)

pspahn (1175617) | about a year ago | (#44257405)

To put it simply, smart phones are now capable of so much more than being simply a phone that their usefulness as a phone has been greatly diminished in the form of terrible battery life compared to what we used to have.

New phones that are simply phones would be nice to see. It doesn't need to have a bunch of power hungry radios in it. Just a phone. With great battery life, quality phone-based features, and that's it. Leave the rest of it for tablets and other doodads.

Re:Is it just me... (2)

mirix (1649853) | about a year ago | (#44257583)

Yep..

This is why I have a Nexus 4 for 'mobile computing', and a circa 2008 Nokia for... using as a phone.

Close to a week of battery life on a single charge is what it's all about, along with legendary call quality, range, etc.

Whenever we need a phone, my girlfriend's S3 is *always* dead, near dead, or charging. The nokia is ready for action. Shame they don't make them anymore.

When we go camping for a long weekend, I don't even need to worry about bringing a charger for the Nokia!

Microsoft Closed OS, possible NSA backdoor (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257477)

It's a Microsoft provided OS, on a mobile device and since Skype has a big NSA backdoor, so likely does this phone. It could report NSA location, meta data, contact names, video feeds, audio feeds, all manner of stuff.

Sorry Nokia, but no.

Only viable option at this point is open source OS, Android (non-Google versions, the Google versions have Google spy crap on them which in turn is now NSA spy crap), Firefox mobile and a few others.

Re:Microsoft Closed OS, possible NSA backdoor (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258011)

Did you personally check the source? The fact that the source is open doesn't mean it's clean it means nobody might care to check it.
And what is the point of using Android without all the Google infrastructure? If you don't care for the apps source for which is not available most of the time, just stick with dumbphones. Though they also have some kind of software which may be tainted by NSA, but Smartphones have bootloader and GSM-modem firmware which is beyond OS controll and might have an NSA backdoor too.

Re:Microsoft Closed OS, possible NSA backdoor (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258243)

The fact the source is open does not mean "nobody might care to check it", it means that someone who might care can check. Now i fully agree that it is not a given that anyone actually does, but that is besides the point - if you care enough at least you can check (and if you do not know how to read code you can pay someone who do) you do not have that option with closed source.

Re:Microsoft Closed OS, possible NSA backdoor (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258341)

The fact the source is open does not mean "nobody might care to check it", it means that someone who might care can check.

Yes, I've messed up that sentence but you've got my poing.
Well, in case you hire someone to perform the source audit you've got to besides paying him trust him. By the way checking for backdoors can also be performed by disassembling the binary blob it just takes more effort. And you'll have to go that route with abovementioned closed-source components.
If that is a question of trust anyway some might happen to trust closed-source product manufacturers enough not to care about the source.

But Win8 really blows (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257487)

Got to play with one a few weeks back. Windows 8 bites. I'm sorry but Microsoft really blew it. It rots as a mobile OS and it sucks even worse as a desktop OS.

41 megapixel of stupidity (0)

swillden (191260) | about a year ago | (#44257519)

41 megapixels? 41 megapixels of blurry, grainy crap with heavy chromatic aberration. Even most DSLR lenses don't provide the optical resolution to make a 41MP sensor valuable, not unless you step up to the top-end lenses which tend to be very large and heavy -- because barring some revolutionary new ideas in optics, that's what it takes to make a lens with that much optical resolution.

The only thing you'll get out of this 41 MP sensor that you wouldn't get out of an 8 MP, or even smaller, is bigger files.

Re:41 megapixel of stupidity (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257567)

The real question is why have we got an AD for a Windows phone on a Linux-ish blog?

Re:41 megapixel of stupidity (5, Informative)

Solandri (704621) | about a year ago | (#44258019)

The iPhone's lens is a 4.1mm focal length f/2.4, so it's 1.71 mm wide. The Rayleigh criterion for a 1.71mm diameter lens in the red spectrum (700 nm) is 0.0286 degrees. That's the smallest angular separation you can resolve using that lens. It gives a view equivalent to a 33mm lens (in the 35mm format), which corresponds to a 57x40 degree field of view (I dunno the aspect ratios on these camera phones so I'll assume 3:2) . So the maximum resolution it supports is 1999x1398, or 2.8 MP.

The Bayer filter means only one pixel in 4 is red, so the camera's 8 MP is effectively capturing only 2 MP of red image data, which is less than the 2.8 MP limit I just calculated. The extra "data" bumping it up to 8 MP is "made up" by the Bayer filter processing algorithm. Unless they go with a bigger lens or a wider field of view, the camera simply can't resolve more than about 8-10 subpixels of data (counting each color pixel as separate). Increase the pixel count and you'll just be capturing two blurry pixels instead of one sharp one. You can see this if you compare a cell phone pic with a DSLR pic at 100%. Because more of the data is "made up" by the Bayer algorithm in the cell phone pic, it looks blurrier than the DSLR pic where adjacent subpixels are getting truly different optical data.

I haven't seen specs on the Lumina 1020 optical hardware. But its predecessor the 808 uses a 8.02mm f/2.4 lens, which is 3.34mm across - nearly twice as wide as the iPhone's. It has an angular resolution limit of 0.0146 degrees. Its field of view is a 26mm equivalent, or 69.4x49.6 degrees. That puts its maximum capture resolution at 4737x3386 pixels, or 16 MP. The 41 MP sensor means about 10.2 MP of red data is captured, which again is less than the 16 MP theoretical limit.

In practical use, the "you need a big lens to capture that much resolution" rule only applies to telephotos. In fact the Rayleigh criterion was derived while probing the theoretical resolving limits of telescopes. If you're using a tiny lens, what you give up in angular resolution you can make back with a wide field of view.

But what about optical quality? One of the advantages of using such a small lens is that it's a lot easier to grind it "perfectly". It takes a lot of work and quality control to grind a professional chunk of glass 77mm in diameter within a fraction of a wavelength to the desired shape. It's much easier to grid a 2mm wide lens into the desired shape, and it doesn't cost you much to just chuck it in the trash if it didn't come out perfectly.

shills... (1, Insightful)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year ago | (#44257545)

It's interesting how the inevitable Windows shills (posting anonymously or from very new accounts) are trying to take the "it just works" aphorism away from Apple. Do you think if you repeat it often enough in relation to Windows Phone, people will just forget what devices the phrase was tied to before?

Caveat, I don't do Apple or M$. (I don't like either of their business models.) But I can spot a slimy marketing technique.

Incidentally, speaking as someone who used to work in marketing for a very large company, if you're going to shill for a company, it's not enough just to say it's the greatest thing since internet porn. You have to say *why* it's better than Jenny McCarthy's centerfold, in some plausible fashion. Just to say "I bought a Windows 8 phone and now my eleven kids are fighting over it and they all want to upgrade their Apple 5's to this" doesn't carry much weight, and parenthetically, seems really unlikely.

Of course, this leaves the shill in the unenviable position of trying to come up with some verifiable advantage to Windows Phone 8.

Re:shills... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258067)

You are missing the point of just working and are extremely paranoid about the shills.
WP is better than Android and iOS not because it has more of something, but because it doesn't have all the shit that modern-day iOS and Android have, it's like a fat-free iOS of old days. Remember the days when everybody claimed that the iPhone will fail because it didn't have MMS or some other crap? But that is what made it popular! Tablets also became popular because they didn't have all the shit desktop OS has.
True MS will end up adding more and more features nobody really needs but claim they do and it will also become bloated, but right now it isn't.

Windows Phone (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257565)

If you check email, surf the web, do some multimedia, make phone calls - Windows Phone absolutely rocks. If you want apps, not so much. I have Windows Phone and have been tempted by Android, but not enough for me to switch to Android. I prefer WP over Apple and BlackBerry. I would guess half of the negative Windows Phone comments on here are people who probably didn't even pick up a device for 2 minutes. Just fashionable to hate on MS here it seems.

Better Sale (0, Troll)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year ago | (#44257755)

I would guess half of the negative Windows Phone comments on here are people who probably didn't even pick up a device for 2 minutes. Just fashionable to hate on MS here it seems.

I know your just paid to promote the dead platform Windows Phone...But really attacking potential customers is not the way. Windows Phone was announced February 15, 2010, and released publicly on November 8, 2010. Its not a new product...its been a failure for a long time, its very heavily promoted; Its just not very good.

Here is the 125 reasons not to buy a Windows Phone http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=44034 [my-symbian.com] and people didn't. Microsoft simply needs a better product, and sell it on those features. Promotional posts are just insulting.

Re:Better Sale (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257909)

How much were you paid to write that?

Re:Better Sale (1)

maxrate (886773) | about a year ago | (#44258101)

Not paid at all. Think it's a great device. I'm defending the device I like. that simple.

Re:Better Sale (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258413)

I know your just paid to promote the dead platform Windows Phone...

Wow... Let me be the first to say, "Fuck you, Tuppe666". You're a well known FOSS/Linux zealot and troll, constantly slandering others with insults and mockery, and on top of it all you throw out empty shill accusations. I'm sure Stallman is very proud of you.

Re:Windows Phone (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44257765)

Allmost all people I know who bought WP regretted it. It does not rock. Even the one person who likes it (a hardcore windows fan) had to admit it has some flaws after he had to reboot it a few times in my presence.

Re:Windows Phone (2)

richlv (778496) | about a year ago | (#44258051)

another anonymous coward post, praising windows on phones, and sounding soooo badly hurt about people not liking it. it probably is fashionable to hate ms in phone shops by that logic :)

No one else bothered by the name? (2)

SuperKendall (25149) | about a year ago | (#44257657)

I have to think they names it the "1020" just to put technical people on edge. So close...

Amazing resolution (0)

Alomex (148003) | about a year ago | (#44257787)

If this were an android or iOS phone people would be drooling over the quantum leap in MPs. But since it is a windows phone (which I too despise) fanbois will come up with arguments why 41MP are actually bad.

Let's be honest people. 41MP is amazing. I still won't be getting one since it runs WiPh, but the camera is amazing. Period. End of Story.

Other specs not so hot. (1)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year ago | (#44257887)

Let's be honest people. 41MP is amazing. I still won't be getting one since it runs WiPh, but the camera is amazing. Period. End of Story.

From he article "4.5-inch, 1,280-by-768 screen. Lumia 1020 is powered by a dual-core, 1.5-GHz Qualcomm MSM8960" ...With the new standard of 5" 1080p quad-core phones especially considering this is twinned with "a high resolution camera" seems really stupid, and from its competitors HTC One(and Butterfly); Samsung Galaxy S4 and Xperia Z(L) as well as an army of cheap Chinese phones Selling at $200 I've been looking at a Neo N003 at $145

Re:Other specs not so hot. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258049)

Are you working for GizChina?

Re:Other specs not so hot. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258359)

I wouldn't mind 1080p, but I don't want a 5-inch screen, 4.5-inch is already bigger than I think a phone should be.

Cores only matter to the extent that they provide a material impact on experience - iPhone and Windows Phone are more fluid on two cores than Android is on four.

Re:Amazing resolution (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258121)

Let's be honest people.

You must be new here.

Actual price? (2)

jrumney (197329) | about a year ago | (#44257821)

$299 seems kind of cheap for a flagship product with this feature set. Is it really $299, or is it $299 + a lot more $ in contractual obligation over the next 2 years?

um... (1)

Charliemopps (1157495) | about a year ago | (#44257973)

An article about a windows phone? Why is this on here? What's Microsoft market share in phones? Doesn't Nintendo sell more phones than them?

(while I'm kidding about Nintendo there is this image: http://cdn.pocketnow.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/6a00d8341c5c9353ef01156f2acdc3970c-800wi.jpg [pocketnow.com] )

Re:um... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258201)

So anything with low market share is irrelevant on Slashdot? Ha-ha!

Re:um... (1)

Barlo_Mung_42 (411228) | about a year ago | (#44258247)

As a nerd I would say this is news relevant to my interests.

What's with the Hate (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258097)

I Love my windows phone I have the Nokia 920 and had HTC with Windows phone 7 before that, Windows Phone is Great, and easy to use, so simple, which is what you want a phone Interface to be, Iphone is old and stale and Android is great, have a Android table and wife has a Android Phone, but nether of them close to the speed and easy of use of the windows phone.

The Nokia phone hardware is great, both of my windows phone have been rock solid apart for updates I have NEVER had to do a restart.

Get one you will love it

Now this phone running MEEGO - that would be news (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#44258113)

I know a few geeks (VERY few) that have WP's
    Personally - I dont care who makes the OS - I care that it lets me do what I want....

  Currently - Android phones give me the most flexibility AND mobile processing power.
              And I can choose the phone that suites the activity I am doing
The frustrating thing about Nokia - is I LOVE their hardware - and I loved Meego - the potential was awesome - and I would pay for something like this - (with a quad core processor though thanks) if it ran Meego. BUT I dont JUST surf the web and read emails (and I have multiple phones and when Im not using a phone - its processing for me because android phones are powerful enough to do decent processing now (in specific area's) Win OS though - its just too limiting - immature AND I cant make it do all the things I want - and I cant CLOSE to near all the apps I want (and If it was Open I wouldnt care - but its not - so its to much trouble to change....

      My question is - how many others WOULD start looking at NOKIA again if they released Meego versions (and the perfect dream would be a Meego phone that would run android apps ) !

Re:Now this phone running MEEGO - that would be ne (2)

Stormwatch (703920) | about a year ago | (#44258319)

If you want a phone with Meego, wait for the Jolla. It's the closest you will ever get.

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